Are Ratepayers the flip side of the same coin?

Causing one to be Blackballed is the Flip side of the same coin

Today, Peter Rosner on a different blog post of mine here made the following comment that I feel needs to be expanded on.

Its like you said before John they appreciate you as long as you are a tool for their message. When you allowed others to express their opinion through that one post some of the ratepayers turned on you instantly. Now you know the type of people you are dealing with. Ironically these same individuals accuse this council of the exact behaviour they exhibit themselves. (emphasis mine). I dont know you you are refering to but they sound like hypocrites to me. I didnt apreciate that particular post either as i felt some good people were being judged pretty harshly but it does give a person food for thought. As we are beginning to see we may be better off with the devil we know.

Recent events have transpired since my The Good, Bad and Ugly of the CNP Fire Department post that make me feel that I am presently being blackballed and shunned by some members of the Crowsnest Ratepayers Association Executive who taking offense have been to cowardly it seems to say anything to my face, and dare not say anything here on this blog using their own name (much like our councillors), but who apparently feel free to besmirch my name and character in secret, behind closed doors, so to speak.

Am I a threat to your future political aspirations, I ask these people? To caste dispersions about my loyalty and commitment to the Ratepayers Association (past and present) is to be blind to both the facts and to reality. I know some of you were around when through my whole term on council I stood shoulder to shoulder with Fred Pyke and George Sturkenboom when I was on council. Was it not I in front of 500 people at the Hillcrest Hall who asked that council, including myself, resign? Was it not I who with my wife stood with protest signs in front of our municipal hall and at MDM a few weeks back? Damn right it was!

Above are the things I have done on behalf of residents here whether they be Ratepayers or not. Now the things I won’t do is put my tongue in my back pocket, refuse to listen to the other side of any debate, argument or issue, or blindly follow without question those who advocate doing those things I just said I won’t do. I’m nobody’s flunky!

I believe if your argument has merit it will stand on its own. If your cause is just it will stand the test of examination and scrutiny. To fear otherwise, is to betray your own cause and to cast doubts on your aspirations. To blame others for causing you these fears and doubts is foolishness and stupidity incarnate. To cause one of your own to be blackballed is inexcusable behaviour unworthy of this organization.

Now is this how the Ratepayers executive wants to be known as people like our mayor and councillors who conduct business behind closed doors in secret, who reach consensus on given issues and people without giving them a chance to either defend themselves or to have any input in their decision making process. Damned by innuendo!

You got something to say, then come out in the open and say it. Isn’t that what we have been demanding from council: openness and transparency? Not backroom deals of intrigue and character assassination, in order to further ones political aspirations?

In this regard, members of the Ratepayers executive should come out and publicly state whether they will be running or not in the next election, so that residents here will know which ones are already on the election campaign trail. And which ones are obviously using dirty tricks to achieve their goal of sitting in the chairs of those they are so obviously eager to replace, and those they fear may be their competition, or whom they do not want to see as mayor or on council. If you are going to use your position to push your political agenda (against me), then I will use my blog to expose you for who and what you are.

As an aside, I say some of this because I’m still pissed off at the fact that at the Hillcrest Miner’s Club (the day when we had the protest march in front of municipal hall) in front of over a hundred people and MLA Pat Stier a vote was taken by the membership to go to petition seeking the removal of mayor and council, and the heads of administration. Only for the executive, and after the fact, arbitrarily deciding the petition would ask for intervention only (which I believe was a terrible mistake)? This to me is how our present council operates. Vote for one thing and get something else.

Are Ratepayers the flip side of the same coin?


It is easier to forgive an enemy than to forgive a friend.

from John Prince
This entry was posted in CNP Politics and tagged , , , , , , . Bookmark the permalink.

19 Responses to Are Ratepayers the flip side of the same coin?

  1. Anonymous says:

    let me put it this way, how do you think you will stack up against Kovach for mayorship

  2. John Prince says:

    Anon @3:40
    Nonsensical question, as Bill has stated on a number of occasions he will not be running.


  3. Anonymous says:

    JP@3:45, I think that I have been blindsided, as a game of poker progresses, a few times. It may be a good question.

  4. Anonymous says:

    Also, I thought it was shabby how it was arbitrarily decreed that Ratepayers board (not “executives”) would be elected equally from four towns regardless of population.

    But it really doesn’t matter. The fact that they have organised the petition gives them no power.

    If any of them want to run for office, it is their right.

    (We need an acronym for the Crowsnest Ratepayers Association. I remember the Reformers had a convention and came up with a new name: “Conservative Reform Alliance Party”, but for some reason did not adopt it. Unless the Ratepayers become a political party, CRA will do.)

  5. The Doomsayer says:

    Good Golly, Miss Molly: I guess my crystal ball AKA beer glass really does work!

    Back on Oct 17/2012 @ 11:22 PM I wrote the following;
    “Groups & individuals fought & still do to this day, the only time they get together is to turn on a supposed “common enemy”. There is absolutely no unified community spirit or cohesion, only the facade.

    Today the enemy is the mayor, council members & CAO. With the bright shimmer of indignation glowing over the community, it was easy to present a facade of a common front. How-ever in the glare of reality, the old feuds emerge. Blairmore hates Coleman, Masons hate Lions, residents hate week-enders & so on! Everyone hates each other for presenting an opposing view point & of course, now scrape-goats are made of those who actually stand up to say something.”

    In spite of some very caustic responses, it now looks like I wasn’t that far out to lunch. The knives are certainly out but, I strongly suspect, not for the reasons given so far.
    John, the Ratepayers or persons associated with them seem to have an issue with you supposedly because of remarks or attitudes of yours to do with their petition, etc but my crystal ball AKA beer glass says this is not so.
    So here again, one of my infamous predictions. What you are experiencing is actually the beginning of an attack campaign which will accelerate in the coming months to culminate with, surprise, surprise, the election. After all, you have had the temerity to announce that you will be running in the coming election. The dark anonymous faces will emerge to be the ones who want to run but don’t have the backbone to announce it now.

    My suggestion for the coming days & months, surround yourself with strong enemies, at least you know what to expect. Remember, an enemy will ford the deepest river & climb the highest mountain to do what they need to, a so-called friend will usually have more excuses than a hypochondriac will have pills.

  6. John Prince says:


    Your insight into human nature is keen and at par with mine. I like that! If I had a dollar for every time a so-called friend stabbed me in the back I’d be a rich man today. It seems the night of the long knifes is already upon us and there is still a year before people here go to the polls. Like Rodney King said, “why can’t we all learn to get along”? Wishful thinking at best, now isn’t it?

    “A wise man gets more use from his enemies than a fool from his friends.” That is why I tend to have more regard and respect for my enemies than many of my so-called (fake) friends, and why I keep them closer to me. Gail Sygutek and I were ‘buds’, even though we were political enemies (wish I could say that about her daughter). :-(

    Again, thank you fro blogging here, and keep it up. You are indeed a breath of fresh air!


  7. Anonymous says:

    Wow guys, here are my thoughts.The ratepayers get organized and start a petition and get almost instant success. Those who oppose the ratepayers start scrambling and start a story about how members of the ratepayers are only doing this to advance their own political careers.Divide and conquer, and you guys just buy right into it,lol.
    Doomsayer, I think you are way off of target on your hate comments, I suppose there may be a few but the general population does not have the hate you are talking about.

  8. Peter Rosner says:

    Anon 9:30 it is more than obvious that some of the ratepayers are going to run in the next election and one has already gone on record as saying they will. Look i support& understand what they are doing i signed the petition also. But what i found right from attending that first meeting is they really are no different than the council that represents us now. They wanted to control things right from the beginning. I just wonder how many people signed that petition not knowing the wording. Many people had already signed before Bill announced that it was not to get rid of this council but to have municipal affairs look into things. And many people in public signed afterwards not getting proper explanation of the the wording. I know the ratepayers empathize with the firemen and the boards that have been let go by this council but where do they really stand on the firemen issue long term. I cannot see how this council views the changes to the fire departments as a cost cutting measure. I believe the taxpayers are going to get soaked for this decision. But if it were to turn out that the firemen are never reinstated then where do the ratepayers stand. I do not oppose the ratepayers but i will not be led around by the nose either. I’ve seen what happened here with the last petition and i am on record as opposing that petition. But again you are entitled to your thoughts as well.

  9. Anonymous says:

    No one ever gets everything they want. The changes this council has instituted so far will add to our tax burden, and all of this was done in the name of efficiency. The petition lets the council know that the residents are not happy with the direction they are taking us. Higher taxes and higher municipal fees are not the “efficiencies” we were promised during the election.

  10. Anonymous says:

    The firefighter issue is over. They have moved along and put into place what they had to. They had the support of the government of Alberta also, so they are probably on the right track. I kind of think that some of the ratepayers people have agendas of their own also – not looking at the whole CNP as a whole, what must be done. I think this council is finally doing that, and if some amalgamation is needed, so be it.

  11. Anonymous says:

    “The firefighter issue is over.” Really?

    Fire response time questioned

  12. Anonymous says:

    If anyone thinks that the Fire Department amalgamation was done efficiently and professionally, they must be the ones in charge of our “change resistant” community. This issue is far from over and the cost of this amalgamation will have to be revisited by the next council. So far, it appears we are heading for fewer personnel, less equipment, high likelihood of less fire halls, and much higher cost to run this new arrangement. When all is said and done, the response time will not likely change as well. All this was done in the name of efficiency and response time. Alberta government supports all the municipal councils in their work, so it will also support the next council in what will need to be done.

  13. Anonymous says:

    Ridiculous article. Were the “anonymous” speakers from the ratepayers. The service seemed good from what I read. Probably the article is a big skewed probably, coming from the infamous”Herald”.

  14. Anonymous says:

    Two versions of the same event. Which to believe? A picture is worth a thousand words… the house was gutted!

  15. Anonymous says:

    Well, hello, sometimes houses are gutted when they have a fire.

  16. Anonymous says:

    Well, Hello, yourself. Sometimes houses are gutted because of response time (under 7 min.) and the manner in which the fire is attacked (managed).

  17. Anonymous says:

    Does the fire department still have the full time temporary fire fighters?

  18. Judy Megli says:

    I’m a member of the Ratepayers and I don’t know of any Ratepayers that are running for council. I think this is a good group with the good of the Pass at the forefront of their actions, but I too, was disappointed that we didn’t go for ousting the Mayor, Council and Administration. I would rather dispose of the problem than let them hobnob with the Government guys, because you know damn well that’s what’s going to happen.

  19. Judy Megli says:

    By the way, I signed my name because I’m not ashamed to state what I stand for either.

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